An Opportunity for Enagic Dealers to Provide Ionized “Kangen Water” for Everyone

In: Kangen Water|Water Ionizers

22 Jun 2010

The simple truth is that ionized or ”Kangen” water can help your body heal itself of many ailments that people face on a day to day basis.  Your body is capable of working brilliantly, but it needs the right fuel mixture, just like any other machine.  Abuse the machine, and the performance deteriorates rapidly and often permanently.  Take care of the machine, and it will work tirelessly for a lifetime.  The great news is that all water ionizers are effective in regards to helping your body heal itself. 

How can something so good be known by so few? 

The level of awareness of water ionizers in many countries in Asia is virtually 100%. How can it be that more than 99% of people in the United States and Canada have never heard of these simple but effective machines despite the fact they have been available here for 8 years? 

The simple answer is that nobody is telling the story.  Let me refine that statement… nobody except the dedicated Enagic dealers have been telling the story.  The water ionizer industry in North America owes its entire existence to the efforts made by Enagic dealers.  

Enagic dealers are just regular people who have discovered that drinking ionized water changed their lives.  When the owners of Enagic water ionizers start seeing positive results, they share the information with others.  This process has been going on, one person at a time since 2004.  The dealers of the Enagic MLM system have sold tens of thousands of machines, which is a huge accomplishment.  However, the number still represents less than one Enagic unit for every five thousand homes in the USA and Canada.   As you can see, Enagic has only scratched the surface when it comes to awareness of water ionizers.  Enagic representatives have done a fantastic job with effective demonstrations and providing education about ionized water during their meetings with prospective clients, but the work has only begun.   

While the Enagic system has been successful, it has the same fatal flaw that eventually ruins most MLM systems.  The flaw is the high price that is charged for the units.  At a price of $3,980, the units are just too expensive for the average person to pay for drinking water.   The price issue is accentuated by the fact that competitive products offered by more traditional distribution systems offer excellent products at much lower prices.

When I was in the water ionizer business, virtually all of my sales were made to people who had been introduced to ionized “kangen water” by an Enagic dealer.  Everyone that contacted me wanted to purchase an Enagic SD501, but the high price turned them off.  As competitors, we would direct potential customers who had been educated by Enagic dealers to the “independent” review sites that offered machines producing similar results for half the cost. Enagic dealers would typically respond to the price difference by bashing our products as being inferior. We would refer to the 8 levels of sales commission paid out for Enagic machines under the MLM system, and presto, the sale was made.  

I suspect that if the price of the Enagic SD501 was under $2,000, the dealers would sell five to ten times as many machines because of the great work done by the Enagic dealers.  Instead, sales are lost to other companies, or the sales are lost because people want the Enagic Sd501 or nothing at all, or sales are lost because people get turned off by the entire process.  Since my goal is to get people drinking ionized water, regardless of the brand, I find it disturbing that so many more people could be drinking the water.  

As time progresses and awareness of the payout structure of Enagic increases, Enagic’s well deserved role as the industry leader will continue to erode.  Additional pressures are building for Enagic dealers who are now faced with updated models offered by Sanastec via the traditional means of distribution.  Now, Vollara has popped up presenting itself as an MLM alternative to Enagic with an untried product that sells for half the cost of the SD501.  The same pattern happens over and over again to MLM organizations, and the dealers often move on to other MLM products as they see the writing on the wall.  I believe it would be a shame for Enagic dealers to move on to other MLM endeavors, because it is the water ionizers themselves that are important, not the MLM system.

I have had a number of high ranking Enagic 5A and 6A dealers contact me recently expressing great concern about the future of Enagic.  The Enagic dealers had always been under the impression that the Enagic machines were superior to all other products.  This impression allowed the dealers to sell their units at $3,980 with a clear conscience.  They correctly believed that nothing is more important than your health, so it was logical for people to pay more for the “best” product.  Enagic dealers believed for years that they were providing a valuable public service to people by telling them that the competitive products were inferior.  As the reality that other machines are as good or even better than Enagic struck home, many Enagic leading dealers have been devastated.  It is easy to understand their frustration, because they are good people who are passionate about helping others.    

My concern is that many of the great Enagic dealers are going to become discouraged and stop educating others about ionized water.  I believe that it is imperative that we keep these incredibly valuable people working with water.  If you are an Enagic dealer who is feeling angry, or if you just feel like giving up, don’t quit!  The game is still in its infancy and we need people like you to continue the education process.     

If you are still experiencing success with Enagic, keep doing what you are doing.  However, you might want to consider investigating other brands that are less expensive.  I can assure you that they are effective.  If you have customers that can’t afford the SD501, put yourself in a position to offer other great products at lower prices.  You know from your own experience that the water works.   

If this article applies to you, but you don’t know where to start, contact me.  I will be happy to take time to answer your questions.  I will provide facts and tell you the truth, without a sales pitch.   There are lots of good machines on the market to choose from.  I believe the key to success is to find people with strong business ethics who will support your efforts.  It will be very difficult to find anyone with a support system as strong as Enagic, but there are good people out there.  My goal is to increase the awareness of the water and I believe that Enagic dealers are the “best of the best” when it comes to educating others about water.  Since I can use all the help I can get, I’m at your service.  

The opinions in this article are those of the author.

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24 Responses to An Opportunity for Enagic Dealers to Provide Ionized “Kangen Water” for Everyone

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David

June 27th, 2010 at 8:05 am

What do you know about the Hydrogen Stick?

[Reply]

rob Reply:
June 27th, 2010 at 8:45 am

Hi David:

I just sent you a long email talking about a new product that will soon be on the market, as well as some comments on the current products that are now available.

I think the Hydrogen sticks are OK, but I would never use one to replace a proper water ionizer. When the price of water ionizers come down in the near future, the demand for cheap alternatives will drop. Hydrogen sticks add minerals to the water, which creates a higher pH. If you simply want a higher pH, there are much cheaper ways to achieve the goal such as using mineral drops, or stirring a spoonful of baking soda into a glass of tap water.

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benkennady

July 1st, 2010 at 5:54 am

Ionized water is known as the “Kangen Water Scam” because they call ionized water “kangen water”.Although the ionizer is a high quality unit, the cost is excessive & way too expensive. The good news is that most companies that sell ionizers are not setup as multi-level marketing businesses.

[Reply]

rob Reply:
July 1st, 2010 at 8:53 am

Hi Ben:

The “Scam” designation is part of the disgraceful behavior that is widespread in the water ionizer industry. If people do their homework, they will discover that the Enagic machines are overpriced in comparison to other water ionizers, but their is no “Scam” going on in terms of the machines being able to ionize water and therefore provide tremendous benefits. It is easy for anyone to determine that Enagic pays out 8 levels of selling fees and their reps will happy to show you the “business opportunity”.

When people talk about “Scams”, the implication is that you are paying for something that the manufacturers or producers sell with the knowledge that they don’t work. For example, think about how many people undergo chemotherapy at $50,000 per session when their physicians know that the treatments won’t help. There is often no reasonable justification for the treatment that is likely to cause much more damage than good in many cases. However, the treatments are still performed on the grounds that perhaps a miracle might happen.

I watched as my Dad’s body was ravaged by chemo when there was no chance of recovery. Now that was a “Scam” that was legally performed by the “leading” practitioners of their time. I would have rather seen my Dad be told to purchase a water ionizer at any price and eat a strict alkaline diet. He may still have died, but at least he would have had a realistic chance to survive. In the very least, the last months of his life would not have been 1,000 times better than the torture that he underwent with chemo.

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Dustin

July 1st, 2010 at 2:21 pm

Hi Rob,

I read the long convo with Gabe and I really enjoyed it.

Did you know that Kangen Water Tm is trademarked by Enagic? Also, the dipping process in which they use on their Medical Grade/Surgical Grade plates is patented as well.

Enagic is the only company on the planet who can make Kangen Grade water…..which is approved by a group of over 6500 Medical Doctors in Japan. In other words, no other company can make Kangen Water except Enagic because they have the patented process which no other company can use.

I was just wondering if you had that information. Also can you show a picture of your lab where you have your 11 machines or maybe post a YouTube video of a quick test?

Make sure you pour all of the water at the same speed too. Also, make sure all of your machines are brand new for fair results.

Satisfied Enagic Owner,

Dustin

[Reply]

rob Reply:
July 1st, 2010 at 3:00 pm

Hi Dustin:

Thanks for the comments. The commitment and loyalty of Enagic owners is legendary.

As we all know, “Kangen” means “back to the source. It has nothing to do with a process. All water ionizers use electrolysis to produce ionized water, including Enagic. The statement “no other company can make Kanger Water except Enagic” is meaningless as all companies can make Kangen/ionized water. The entire “Kangen” trademark is worthless marketing hype. Sorry for being so brutal, but the Enagic dealers use this type of nonsense in an attempt to diminish the other machines in the industry. Sanastec now uses the Kangen name and I bet all the other companies can as well if they bothered to challenge the trademark.

The info you provided about Medical Grade/Surgical Grade plates is marketing “garblygook”. It means nothing. The plates themselves have very little to do with the output of the machines, and the coating definitely has nothing to do with the performance at all. The platinum coating only serves a protective surface over the titanium plates. In fact, the coating process for the plates used by Enagic is nothing to brag about based upon the research I have done.

I’m not here to bash Enagic, as I really appreciate all the hard work their dealers have done. However, when false or meaningless statements are made (and Enagic dealers are the undisputed kings of false statements) it makes me angry. I don’t care how Enagic or anyone else markets their products as long as they are not making false statments that appear to make other products seem less authentic or beneficial to your health.

I’m spending my summer in Muskoka at my summer home for the 44th year. I have had a lot of people encouraging me to do real “independent” videos without a business angle. I’m spending the next two months at my summer home in Muskoka, but when I return to my home in September, I will purchase a video recorder and some lighting so that I can start doing videos from my lab. I will set up some kind of review site within my blog so that people can watch videos of different machines. Each video will feature one machine only, and will illustrate how the machines works and my comments on the machine. The videos won’t feature comparison tests, because all the machines work and it is too easy to play with the numbers if you know what you are doing.

You can be certain that I won’t be working with NEW machines unless companies want to send me new machines to test. I already have far too many machines according to my wife, so purchasing more machines is out of the question. Perhaps you would like to send me a brand new SD501 to test, but it doesn’t make sense as the one that I have is less than a year old.

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Dustin

July 25th, 2010 at 12:45 am

Hello again,

So metal doesn’t matter inside of an ionizer?

What do you know about service centers inside USA for ionizers?
From my research I have found that to be a problem with most
Korean made machines.

Which machine do you drink from?

Dustin

[Reply]

rob Reply:
July 25th, 2010 at 1:29 am

Hi Dustin:

I’m not sure I understand what you are referring to when you talk about metal in a water ionizer.

Each of the major companies some of the lesser known companies that sell water ionizers in the USA provide domestic service centres. As far as I know, the companies all do a reasonably good job in servicing their machines. None of the companies actually repair damaged products, as they simply replace faulty parts. Therefore, the repair work can be done by removing a few screws and popping in a new replacement part.

I drink water from several different machines as I have about ten different kinds.

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Mike

August 1st, 2010 at 9:52 pm

Hello Rob,
Thank you for this info, I was introduced to Kangen water on Facebook and knew nothing about the company or the technology. I was excited about what I had heard and it made sense to me. I was anxious to try it out, when I found out the price tag… needless to say, I am still without ionized water. I can not afford a $4k machine, no matter what it does.
I am only 40 yrs old and suffer from a few health problems that are very premature for someone my age. I came across someone selling the Vollara unit and found out the machine is half price. This is much more attainable for me, however I want to know that I am not throwing $2k away by buying something that is poor quality. The Kangen unit claimed to do more to help your health with its drinking water than just the ionizer, but I don’t remember the details. Are these other things just fluff, or are there other benefits to be had from the drinking part of it (I know you can clean with the water too, and use it to help the skin, etc)
Specifically I am dealing with Psoriasis and Psoriatic Arthritis, and what I am wondering is the Kangen unit offering something more than these other machines, that may help me deal with my health issues? One of the other claims that comes to mind is the restructering of the molocules so it is more absorbable.
Greatly appreciate any thoughts or input you may have on this.
Thanks,
Mike

[Reply]

rob Reply:
August 2nd, 2010 at 10:33 pm

Hi Mike:

I understand your concern about the price of the Kangen units as $4,000 is a lot of money. However, I wouldn’t choose the Vollara product as an alternative at this point in time. I haven’t got my hands on a Vollara unit to test it yet, but Gabe (one of the valuable participants in this thread) has informed me that the Vollara only has one ionizer product and it runs on very low power and only has one plate. You can purchase the best water ionizer money can buy for about $1,700, so it doens’t make any sense to pay $2,000 for an untested unit like the Vollara. I would let someone else be the Guinea Pig.

I’m in no position to offer medical advice. I can however tell you from my own personal experience that drinking water eliminated the debilitating arthrits that was diminishing my life. I have also talked to dozens, if not more than one hundred people who have enjoyed significant relief of their arthritic symptoms once they began drinking ionized water.

I have never had psoriasis, but I have spoken to several people that have experienced significant relief after drinking the alkaline water and swathing the affected skin with acidic water.

Will you achieve results similar to those I have mentioned above? There is no way to know for certain, but you can be sure that the water won’t hurt you.

If you have any doubts about the ability of the water to help you, perhaps you might consider contacting someone you know who owns a machine. You could drink water from their machine to see how the the water affects you. If you don’t know anyone who has a machine, call a company that sells water ionizers and ask them to provide you with test water, or refer you to one of their clients in your area. I believe Kangen representatives provide potential customers with free water for a month or two before cutting them off. Personally, I don’t like the practice but I can see how it would be effective. When I was was in the water ionizer business, I used to sell a lot of units to people who called in that had been cut off by their Kangen representative. The callers wanted to buy a machine because of the benefits, but were turned off by the price and by the pressure put on them the Kangen dealer.

I hope you make the effort to test the water or purchase a machine. I expect you will join the hundreds of thousands of people that faithfully drink the water.

[Reply]

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Gabe

August 3rd, 2010 at 2:56 pm

Hi Rob/Mike,

Glad I stopped by today!

Rob, I’d only make one correction to what you said. The Vollara unit doesn’t use 1 plate, it uses direct disk ionization. It converts water thru electrolysis, but the way it does is with a disk electrode. Saying the unit only has 1 plate [in the world of plates] gives the impression of low quality water. It’s apples and oranges. It’s also important to know Vollara just isn’t a new ionizer importer. It’s a new subsidiary of Aerus, who also owns electrolux, land o’lakes, horizon organic dairy, etc. Solid companies and long histories. To my knowledge, only 1 other company is tryig to drive cost down right now. The rest are going for bigger, better and more expensive. There’s room to continue decreasing, but at least it’s starting.

I don’t just use Vollara in my inventory, there are a few others I make available [after the recommendation of a few...including Rob], but I’ve found the water to be not only comparable, but in some cases better. Especially in extreme high/low TDS.

Mike, if you’d like to talk, please let me know. I do [and will] give a 60 day $ back guarantee. Even long-distance. If I know someone close to you with a Vollara unit, I’ll see if I can arrange a way for you to get the water and look at the unit. I’ll give Rob my contact info again, although I think he has it. If you’re interested, ask him.

Here you go Rob. Black it out for the forum if you’d like. 785-856-3912, iesolutions@ymail.com, skype: gabehunninghake

Bottoms up!
Gabe

[Reply]

rob Reply:
August 4th, 2010 at 10:37 pm

Hi Gabe:

Thanks for the correction. As I mentioned before, I don’t know much about the Vollara.

I must force myself to keep an open mind when it comes to a MLM system when it comes to the water ionizer business. I like the fact that there has been a move to establish lower prices. However, I find it hard to believe in a company that has so many different products in so many different fields. Where is the focus and the committment to research and product development? An example of my concern is the Enagic SD501. The machine is made by Toyo, a world famous tire manufacturer, who has not improved or updated the machine in 14 years. The SD501 is just the old Pureport II with a different face.

Vollara only offers one product that has been brought to the attention of the MLM company. It will be interesting to see how it all turns out. In the meantime, great water ionizers with proven track records from well established manufacturers can be purchased for $1,700 and the prices are definitely starting to drop. It seems to me that if Vollara is already behind before it really gets started.

I didn’t remove your contact information like I normally do for contributors. While I’m against self promotion on this blog, you have been a great contributor to the thread and you know more about Vollara than I do. To be fair to readers, it makes sense for anyone interested in the Vollara machine to contact you.

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Mary Drumm

August 13th, 2010 at 10:54 pm

Dear Rob,

Thanks so much for all of the information on ionized water that you have provided and for your unbiased approach. I agree that Enagic folks have done a fantastic job educating, but I too am allergic to MLM and feel it is too bad that such an important product can’t be produced and sold for for much less so that many more people could enjoy the tremendous health benefits.

I have high BP, diabetes, CAD, congestive heart failure, arthritis, degenerative disc disease, GERD and I’m in a wheelchair because of severe spinal cord compression that has caused exstensive nerve damage. I don’t expect miracles, but do believe in the tremendous benefits of alkaline water. I just cannot afford a $2,000, much less a $4,000, machine. You said the best unit on the market can be purchased for $1,700 so where can I can I buy it and what kind of guarantee/support comes with it?

I am amazed that almost everyone in Asia has heard of this technlogy and such a small fraction of American and Canadian families know about this life changing water. God bless you for getting the word out!

[Reply]

rob Reply:
August 14th, 2010 at 10:27 am

Hi Mary:

Thanks for the kind words.

Whenever life starts to get me down, I just have to think about how lucky I am to have my health and family. Yesterday, I got a call at 9am from my son. He was returning from an errand and a deer jumped in front of his vehicle on the highway. He swerved to miss the deer and got caught in the loose gravel. A couple of seconds later, he was upsidedown at the bottom of a ditch, having rolled over 1 1/2 times. The SUV was demolished but my son was fine and he crawled out the rear passenger window. Sorry for the digression, but it is on my mind and heh, it is my blog.

There are no guarantees when it comes to health. Water ionizers help so many people, but not everyone. The water also helps for many ailiments, but not all ailiments. The water ionizer companies typically offer a 60 day money back guarantee. Some companies offer a full refund during the 60 day period, while others typically charge a 15% restocking fee. The 15% restocking fee is more than fair and should be charged because the vendor loses the credit card charge (about 2.5%) and must check out and clean the machine and install new filters. Then the machine has to be sold at a discount as a demo unit. When I was in the business, I found that a returned unit acutally cost about 30%, so the 15% restocking fee only partially covered the loss. Again I digress.

There are a number of great water ionizers available on the market now. Unfortunately, most of them are priced in the $2,000 to $2,500 range. The EOS Platinum is a top of the line machine that currnetly sells for $1,695. It has everything the other leading machines have, and more. There is still room for the price of the machine to go lower, but at least it’s a step in the right direction. I suspect that it is just a matter of time before the competition realizes that the public wants and will eventually demand lower prices. Tyent was selling a lower quality EOS model which Tyent called the IonQuench for $1,440 that is also a good unit. However, I believe that EOS has stopped making the units for Tyent, so I don’t know who makes the IonQuench machines. I would need to know who is making the IonQuench machines now before I would recommend it.

I agree with you that it is a travesty that less than 1/10 of 1 percent of people in Canada and the USA know about water ionizers. I have made it my life goal to change that. Sometimes I feel like I’m swimming upstream all the time, but it is comments like yours that keep me going.

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Gabe

August 23rd, 2010 at 10:57 am

Thanks Rob. You may be right. I think Vollara looked at their competition as Enagic only. While there are other manufactures, Enagic is the only company hitting the streets trying to help people. They do the hard work and then Tyent, LifeIonizers, etc grab the sale because of their lower prices.

Just for clarification, Vollara offers numerous other products through their network of distributors. Electricity recycling/surge protection, laundry systems that eliminate detergent, air purification, etc. They have point people responsible for each area and an entire section focused on new product development. They will continue to improve in all industries, but unless Enagic gets their act together and begins dropping prices instead of just adding more plates, there won’t be much of a push. What’s on the drawing board is some pretty amazing stuff…and like it or not, very little of which can be found outside of the MLM world.

I have my frustrations as well, one of which is the stereotype MLM reputation. Some of it deservedly so, but most is not when given a fair look. If a MLM company can effectively train and motivate their sales force to do the hard work of introducing ionizers, then they should get paid more than the ones who sit back, design misleading “reviews” and then smear the initial company/distributor just to make the sale. (By more, I do not mean $2,000 more) Vollara’s top line product is priced in line with EOS, Chanson, etc, but still allows income for the business owner who’s done the hard work of introducing and helping.

Unfortunately, it seems the ionized water industry is becoming polluted.

BTW…my latest series has been on cancer. Talk about a scam. Click my name and it should like to it.

[Reply]

rob Reply:
August 24th, 2010 at 9:58 pm

Hi Gabe:

Sorry I missed you on Skype the other day.

If Vollara product is good and they market as well as Enagic, then I think they will do well regardless of their miscalculation on prices. I still need to take apart a Vollara machine and test it before I can offer any worthwhile opinion.

I hope that the “pollution” that you refer to in the industry will clear up over time. We need to continue to put pressure on the companies to play fair and play nice so that public doesn’t think the whole industry is a scam. I continue to remain optimistic….otherwise my blog is a waste of time.

I will take a look at your series on cancer as I enjoy your work on your blog.

[Reply]

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Gabe

August 26th, 2010 at 10:46 am

No problem. I missed you first. :)

I’ve been thinking a lot about the miscalculation on price recently. The more I think from Vollara’s perspective, the more I think it’s completely and accurately calculated. Follow this logic with me.

Vollara is a network company. They grow more by increasing the size of their distribution network than they do through end user sales only. Therefore they add incentives to packages of products to start a business with more than they do retail profit.

Here’s an example in numbers. I can sell a $1999 ionizer to a customer and make a $700 profit. Any vollara distributor can at any level. The person with 1 week in business makes the same retail profit as someone who’s been working for 15 years.

However, I can also offer the customer already willing to spend $1999 another choice. And I don’t care if they want to develop extra income or not. I can register them as a dealer and for $1999, they get the following:

1- Alkaline Water Ionizer

1- FreshAir Surround Environmental Treatment System which sanitizes the air and all surfaces within a 3000 sq. ft space. Proven by numerous university and gov’t studies.

1- LaundryPure which eliminates the need for hot water, detergent, fabric softner and sorting. They clothes are truly clean, not just covered with chemical scents. [Hotels and medical facilities like these]

2 months of nutritional/cellular support including Immunitize (google it).

I think anyone would see that as a good deal and very few are going to go with the ionizer alone.

For me, the beauty of that is I’ve just helped the client on a much larger level. Their home is safer, their clothes last longer, they save money in a very short return period and they have the option of making some part-time money [if they want to] by helping others be healthier as well.

My profit is $640 for that package with no long term monthly expenses or requirements to the client. I’m not upselling anything. I’m just adding additional value.

The client is also not stuck with 3 other expensive ionizers to sell and if they don’t want a business they don’t have to work it. They just keep the products and all parties are happy.

So…I don’t think Vollara priced the ionizer to sell 1 at a time. I think they wholesale priced the entire package at half the enagic so we can show a client how much more they can get for 50% of the investment. Or for how much more they can get for roughly the same cost as a tyent, eos, chason, etc.

Since their inception, Vollara has talked about uncompromising health because no one wants to be just partially healthy. I think I now see how they plan on implementing and sharing that vision.

Let me know if you want a package…then you can take the ionizer apart.

Just kidding.. :)

Gabe

[Reply]

rob Reply:
August 27th, 2010 at 8:03 am

Hi Gabe:

Good to see you keeping up the vigil.

Your list of crosses the border of a sales pitch, but I let it go because you have given so much to this blog.

The extras cost you $60 based upon your profits dropping from $700 to $640. That seems like an inexpensive way to introduce products to clients with the hope of capturing future business, so it seems like a good business idea. Whether people want those extras is another question.

Thanks for providing the math on the profit structure. Based upon a retail sales price of $1995 and your profit from the sale of a unit of $700, that means the MLM company is providing the unit to the system for $1,295. Based upon what I know about conventional water ionizers, that introductory price is way way way too high. I don’t know the cost to make the Vollara, but based upon the description you have given me in the past, I suspect that the company itself is probably making about $1,000 per unit. If the company dropped their huge profit margins, the unit could easily sell for $1,500, which would make the price more palatable.

Ultimately, the real measusing stick is whether the Vollara works. Any comparison of prices is irrelevant without taking the performance and durability and ease of use, and ongoing operating costs into consideration. I don’t know the answers to any of those factors, so it is unfair for me to comment.

I really value your input on this blog. Up to this most recent post, you have been able to keep the rah rah down, but it slipped right out on this one. I’m happy that you are excited about your business opportunity, but the goal of this blog is to provide informaton. Words like “uncompromising health” sound very MLM to me.

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Dustin

August 27th, 2010 at 12:54 am

Hi Rob and Gabe,
Glad to have stopped by for a check up on the amazing ionizer blog. I commend you both for your knowledge and opinions about particular ionizers out there.
I have some questions for both of you and I really believe that these will be beneficial for the inexperienced ionized water drinker.
1) What are your thoughts about http://www.kangenlegend.com?
2) what is the value of an ISO certification?
3) why do some ionizers pass face value tests and then return to tap where as others maintain more stable readings? Watts? Power?
4) what is the average mark up on an ionizer and how do you know how much it costs to make?
5) is there a difference between MLM and Direct Sales?
6) why would our country shut down if all salespeople quit work for only 24 hours?

Truly,
Dustin

[Reply]

rob Reply:
August 27th, 2010 at 8:36 am

Hi Dustin:

Gabe has been great. Thanks for recognizing his efforts.

I will answer your questions by number as they are easier to follow.

1) I checked out th website. It is a well done and expensive Kangen promotional site. The information is so promotional that it turned me off. Phases like “chosen by 6,500 Japanese doctors” is typical of Enagic. If you read the detail behind the statement, the association that includes 6,500 doctors chose Enagic over other entries. How much do you think that has to do with endorement money and efforts versus 6,500 doctors actually choosing Enagic over other machines.

2) I don’t put a great deal of value on ISO certification. It is a good thing, but I put much more value on UL or CSA (or their accepted derivatives) approval. ISO is a measure of plant quality and has very little or really nothing to do with a product.

3) I don’t understand your question. I believe you are asking why some machines water that has improved pH and ORP values initially and then return to the original values found in the tap water, while others don’t. Sounds like a Kangen remark to me as they are always claiming superiority for one thing or another. The reality is that water is very stable and ionization alters that stability. Altered pH remains alter for extended periods of time while ORP returns to pre-existing values much faster. My testing of various machines doesn’t prove anything conclusive in terms of comparisons between the longevity of altered conditions. The results vary depending on so many factors that the entire arguement becomes irrelevent. The bottom line is that the goal is to drink the water as fresh as possilbe.

4) The markups are huge. In general, the markups on most direct selling units are in the 300% to 400% range. In defence of the industry, the markups are not excessive compared to many products that we buy. However, the electonics industy operates on small margins and these products are electronic products. Only one tenth of one percent of home have in the USA and far less in Canada own water ionizers. Once the awareness grows, the prices will come down. If you remember back a few years, a 42″ plasma tv cost $9,500 while you can purchase more advanced but similar products for well under $1,000. I expect that water ionizers will be available in the $1,000 range at places like Costco in the next few years if sales volumes increase.

5) MLM or multi level marketing relies upon a self motivated marketing team that has many layers of commission. Direct sales usually consits of levels as well, but fewer levels. Direct sales typically have a manufacturer, a manufacturing agent, various distributors operating in different countries or territories, wholesalers, and dealers. The mannufacturing agent typically adds 10%, Distributors typically add 10% to 15%. The percentage added by wholesalers is all over the map, but the range seems to be 20% to 40%. Retails/dealers usually double the price. So, when you add it all up, if the price out of the factory is $1, the price to the consumer is about $4. For an MLM product like Enagic water ionizers, the price and margins about about double the products sold by direct sales.

6) I answer questions about water and the products relating to water. I leave it at that

[Reply]

Avatar

Gabe

August 27th, 2010 at 3:31 pm

Hey Rob.

I just have a few minutes, so no long post. My list was not for the world to see…just wanted you to get an idea of what I think Vollara is thinking. From my perspective as a business owner, I like the leverage it gives me.

I should have just sent you a direct email, but I know you can approve/disapprove comments as needed.

My only other thought is with respect to duration. Only time will tell I guess. The DDI system went through extensive testing so I’m not worried about functionality problems. Especially in light of how Vollara has righted the ship when it came some of the other technologies they now manufacture.

Good results this week. 1 client who hasn’t been able to loose weight in a year despite working out and watching the diet has lost 5 lbs in 10 days. Another who is battling diabetes is seeing improvement in blood sugar levels and a third with acid reflux and fibromyalgia is improving as well. The last 2 have tried medicines for 20+ yrs. Only the water has shown signs of working.

[Reply]

rob Reply:
August 29th, 2010 at 9:21 am

Hi Gabe:

I would not have allowed your post or responded to it on the blog if you had let me know that it was a FYI only message.

Great news in regards to the feedback from your clients.

Weight loss: I have talked to hundreds of people who have lost from 5 to 70 pounds of weight once they begin drinking the water. The water doesn’t work for everyone but it works for a a good percentage of people

Diabetes: I have talked to several (not hundreds) of people who have experienced great results when they started drinking the water. Their insulin levels drop by siginificant amounts and it seems that the fluctuations in their insulin levels level out.
Acid Reflux: The improvement in acid reflux is almost universal among the hundreds of people that I have spoken with. I had a very bad case of acid reflux and mine was fixed within a week and I haven’t taken any more medication for more than two years.

fibromyalgia: When I was in the water ionizer business, I corresponded with three different women that suffered terribly from fibromyalgia. The water changed their lives to the point that the Fibromyalgia was no longer an issue in their lives.

If you would like to share the individual stories that you have outlined in your post, I would be happy to post them on the blog.

[Reply]

Avatar

توفيق قضاتي

August 29th, 2010 at 3:10 am

سلام
برگردان يا ترجمعه شما ضعيف بود من هميقدر فهميدم كه شما دستگاه يونيزه كردن آب را در كانادا داريد و نمايندگي ميدهيد شما بمن ايميل بزنيد كه شرايط نمايندگي شما چيست تا من هم شايد پيشنهادي ساده بدهم من در ايران شهر تهران زندگي مي كنم

[Reply]

rob Reply:
August 29th, 2010 at 10:45 am

Hi:

I wish I could communicate in more languages, but my only language is English. Sorry!

[Reply]

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About this blog

My name is Rob Thomas. I’m 53 years old, retired, and I live in a small town near Toronto, Canada

I created this blog to share my knowledge and experience with alkaline ionized water. The water changed my life by eliminating my acid reflux and osteo-arthritis in 2008.

This blog morphed into something far greater than it was ever intended, as others began to share their experiences... learn more about me

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